AI... A new dawn, or the demise of humanity ?
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@phenomlab in theory, this is already doable… but not “wirelessly”… I guess this is what they are trying to achieve…
in short, when you want to move your pinky finger, you activate certain neuron combinations in the brain and make a certain region of your brain “active” (neurons are activated by the movement of sodium and potassium in/out of the cells and therefore creating “electrical charge polarization” ), so even if your brain cannot control finger muscles, for example due to an injury, this information still can be picked up by the electrodes that are scanning the brain. So, as far as I understood, they are trying to build a technology to convert these electrodes with cables into wireless chips…
I will look further here: https://clinicaltrials.gov (after a quick search, I could not find the name of the company, so I am assuming they are collaborating with some researchers from some institutions)
all clinical trials in the US will be reported here, and results will be shared…
But I would not trust Elon’s tweet for the results of the experiments…we should wait until scientific papers are published… if anything, he is lying and promoting the stocks of this company… this is what he does, he is a manipulator and liar, and he can say anything for economical gain…
@crazycells said in AI... A new dawn, or the demise of humanity ?:
But I would not trust Elon’s tweet for the results of the experiments…we should wait until scientific papers are published… if anything, he is lying and promoting the stocks of this company… this is what he does, he is a manipulator and liar, and he can say anything for economical gain…
Very interesting points you raised in the above post, and you clearly know more about this than I do - and have a better understanding. I appreciate how this technology can assist those who are mobility impaired, but do worry about it being abused in the future, and I’m sure it will be. I also worry about the safety of such technology.
And you’re right. Elon doesn’t care about the safety aspect and is more focused on the bottom line - profit.
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@crazycells said in AI... A new dawn, or the demise of humanity ?:
But I would not trust Elon’s tweet for the results of the experiments…we should wait until scientific papers are published… if anything, he is lying and promoting the stocks of this company… this is what he does, he is a manipulator and liar, and he can say anything for economical gain…
Very interesting points you raised in the above post, and you clearly know more about this than I do - and have a better understanding. I appreciate how this technology can assist those who are mobility impaired, but do worry about it being abused in the future, and I’m sure it will be. I also worry about the safety of such technology.
And you’re right. Elon doesn’t care about the safety aspect and is more focused on the bottom line - profit.
@phenomlab and he is not the scientist of the project… If he is announcing the results or hinting the results, I believe he aims manipulation.
I will check the clinical trials website for more details later when I have more time…On a side note, this chip placement is an invasive operation, I believe they have to place the chip under the skull, so that it can sense which part of the brain is active. Namely, they have to open a crack on your skull to achieve this. These things are usually not ethical to perform on a healthy person, or someone who will not get any benefit out of it.
Additionally, its use is limited, and I believe in the second article it is exaggerated a lot (when they say it will eventually cure obesity, autism, depression, or schizophrenia). In the first article, it says “it will enable control of your phone or computer, and through them almost any device, just by thinking”… I believe this will be the main use case of these chips(if they become successful) , but Elon is manipulating to soar his stock prizes
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@phenomlab and he is not the scientist of the project… If he is announcing the results or hinting the results, I believe he aims manipulation.
I will check the clinical trials website for more details later when I have more time…On a side note, this chip placement is an invasive operation, I believe they have to place the chip under the skull, so that it can sense which part of the brain is active. Namely, they have to open a crack on your skull to achieve this. These things are usually not ethical to perform on a healthy person, or someone who will not get any benefit out of it.
Additionally, its use is limited, and I believe in the second article it is exaggerated a lot (when they say it will eventually cure obesity, autism, depression, or schizophrenia). In the first article, it says “it will enable control of your phone or computer, and through them almost any device, just by thinking”… I believe this will be the main use case of these chips(if they become successful) , but Elon is manipulating to soar his stock prizes
@crazycells said in AI... A new dawn, or the demise of humanity ?:
On a side note, this chip placement is an invasive operation, I believe they have to place the chip under the skull, so that it can sense which part of the brain is active. Namely, they have to open a crack on your skull to achieve this. These things are usually not ethical to perform on a healthy person, or someone who will not get any benefit out of it.
Based on this, I’m guessing that ordinary people aren’t exactly queuing up for this…
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@crazycells said in AI... A new dawn, or the demise of humanity ?:
On a side note, this chip placement is an invasive operation, I believe they have to place the chip under the skull, so that it can sense which part of the brain is active. Namely, they have to open a crack on your skull to achieve this. These things are usually not ethical to perform on a healthy person, or someone who will not get any benefit out of it.
Based on this, I’m guessing that ordinary people aren’t exactly queuing up for this…
@phenomlab no, ordinary people cannot get this… basically, the company is trying to achieve to turn the cap below, into a chip that is implanted near brain to be able to read the signals…
This is not something like a cosmetic surgery, so FDA will not approve this for “general use”, it will have a specifically defined target group; and it can be used only for those people. I checked the clinical trials, and searched for “brain computer interface”, for example this study from Mexico has this eligibility criteria:
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Inclusion Criteria:
Spinal Cord Injury at neurological levels C6 or C7
American Spinal Injury Association (ASIA) classification A, B, C or D
Upper limb spasticity of less or equal to +1 measured with the Modified Ashworth Scale
Time since disease onset of more than 6 months and less than 60 months
Normal or corrected to normal vision -
Exclusion Criteria:
Severe attention deficits
Previous diagnosis of traumatic brain injury
Previous diagnosis of peripheral nerve injury
Previous stroke diagnosis
Previous diagnosis of neurodegenerative diseases
History of fractures in upper extremities
Skin lesions
Contractures in upper extremities that hamper mobility
Excessive muscle spasms
So, when this study is concluded, it can only be used for this specific target group. I wish eventually this technology would be used for other neurological diseases, but currently it is very unlikely. We need way more research to be done before reaching this aim… Elon is currently manipulating the stocks…
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@phenomlab no, ordinary people cannot get this… basically, the company is trying to achieve to turn the cap below, into a chip that is implanted near brain to be able to read the signals…
This is not something like a cosmetic surgery, so FDA will not approve this for “general use”, it will have a specifically defined target group; and it can be used only for those people. I checked the clinical trials, and searched for “brain computer interface”, for example this study from Mexico has this eligibility criteria:
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Inclusion Criteria:
Spinal Cord Injury at neurological levels C6 or C7
American Spinal Injury Association (ASIA) classification A, B, C or D
Upper limb spasticity of less or equal to +1 measured with the Modified Ashworth Scale
Time since disease onset of more than 6 months and less than 60 months
Normal or corrected to normal vision -
Exclusion Criteria:
Severe attention deficits
Previous diagnosis of traumatic brain injury
Previous diagnosis of peripheral nerve injury
Previous stroke diagnosis
Previous diagnosis of neurodegenerative diseases
History of fractures in upper extremities
Skin lesions
Contractures in upper extremities that hamper mobility
Excessive muscle spasms
So, when this study is concluded, it can only be used for this specific target group. I wish eventually this technology would be used for other neurological diseases, but currently it is very unlikely. We need way more research to be done before reaching this aim… Elon is currently manipulating the stocks…
@crazycells said in AI... A new dawn, or the demise of humanity ?:
I wish eventually this technology would be used for other neurological diseases, but currently it is very unlikely. We need way more research to be done before reaching this aim… Elon is currently manipulating the stocks…
As do I. There are also those who suffer with other illnesses such as Fibromyalgia which is one that has no outward signs, but is extremely debilitating for the person who suffers with it. Another would be Myalgic Encephalomyelitis or Chronic Fatigue syndrome (ME/CFS) and this is where that technology could enrich lives.
Elon is not concerned with any of that - just the bottom line as I previously stated.
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I dread to think what this will look and behave like if Meta’s well-known cavalier attitude to privacy is anything to go by
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I dread to think what this will look and behave like if Meta’s well-known cavalier attitude to privacy is anything to go by
@phenomlab I doubt anyone will have faith or confidence in either Meta or Mark Zuckerberg…
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@phenomlab I doubt anyone will have faith or confidence in either Meta or Mark Zuckerberg…
@crazycells said in AI... A new dawn, or the demise of humanity ?:
@phenomlab I doubt anyone will have faith or confidence in either Meta or Mark Zuckerberg…
Hard to argue
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Now here’s an interesting spin - legitimate interest and concern, or just a publicity stunt?
We know Elon is all about profits, so it’s unexpected to see this stance…
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Now here’s an interesting spin - legitimate interest and concern, or just a publicity stunt?
We know Elon is all about profits, so it’s unexpected to see this stance…
@phenomlab said in AI... A new dawn, or the demise of humanity ?:
We know Elon is all about profits, so it’s unexpected to see this stance…
lol, this is really ridiculous and I know for sure that he does not have good intentions… but I feel OK about this lawsuit, because I do not think OpenAI is right to keep GPT-4 closed source and their relation with Microsoft bothers me a lot… If you have founded and funded as non-profit… you can not just become for-profit, right after you succeeded something…
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@phenomlab said in AI... A new dawn, or the demise of humanity ?:
We know Elon is all about profits, so it’s unexpected to see this stance…
lol, this is really ridiculous and I know for sure that he does not have good intentions… but I feel OK about this lawsuit, because I do not think OpenAI is right to keep GPT-4 closed source and their relation with Microsoft bothers me a lot… If you have founded and funded as non-profit… you can not just become for-profit, right after you succeeded something…
@crazycells said in AI... A new dawn, or the demise of humanity ?:
If you have founded and funded as non-profit… you can not just become for-profit, right after you succeeded something…
Sadly, we see this on an increasing basis with open source projects that start out as FOSS and then slowly start charging for services under the guise of “premium”.
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@crazycells Hmm - that link doesn’t seem to work…?
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@phenomlab hmm, since the url contains the word j e r k , it is not clickable…
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@crazycells Hmm - that link doesn’t seem to work…?
@phenomlab the last 4 letters before the html should be j e r k but it is converted to * by the forum filter…
here is the shortened url: https://bit.ly/3TD7zyC
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well, it is not surprising… I do believe that human are inherently racist , due to the extension of xenophobia coded in our DNA… But we have “public education” to overcome this and teach young generations tolerance and indulgence; and teach them how a 21st century society should function…
This racism can be observed directly or indirectly in all products throughout the history, and if AI is trained with these written materials, of course it will learn to be racist or at least be biased.
And I am not talking about racism against blacks only… We have much more than this… I just watched Cabrini two days ago and loved the movie (definitely recommend). I was surprised to see the intolerance and racism against Italians by Irish and English in early 1900s in New York.
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well, it is not surprising… I do believe that human are inherently racist , due to the extension of xenophobia coded in our DNA… But we have “public education” to overcome this and teach young generations tolerance and indulgence; and teach them how a 21st century society should function…
This racism can be observed directly or indirectly in all products throughout the history, and if AI is trained with these written materials, of course it will learn to be racist or at least be biased.
And I am not talking about racism against blacks only… We have much more than this… I just watched Cabrini two days ago and loved the movie (definitely recommend). I was surprised to see the intolerance and racism against Italians by Irish and English in early 1900s in New York.
@crazycells yes, sadly, we live in a world where racism is present in all walks of life, not excluding the Internet where it is arguably the worst purely because of the ability to remain anonymous and hide behind a keyboard.
If this is what large scale language models are using for enrichment, then it’s no wonder we’ve landed up here.
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@phenomlab the last 4 letters before the html should be j e r k but it is converted to * by the forum filter…
here is the shortened url: https://bit.ly/3TD7zyC
@crazycells Seems this link requires you to sign up for NY times. Adding the below to replace it
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@crazycells Seems this link requires you to sign up for NY times. Adding the below to replace it
https://www.theverge.com/2016/3/24/11297050/tay-microsoft-chatbot-racist
@phenomlab oh right, thanks… i forgot ny times is like that…
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